As I said before, Joe died because Spoony killed him. The party pissed off Spoony for some reason or another and he wasn't in the mood for Joe. As such, TORCHA for those three, and 57 damage for Joe.

It wasn't the party that pissed off Spoony, from what I witnessed. Personally, I think him trying to get Mazes and Monsters edited before heading off to his convention, plus the anti-team antics of Joe just pushed him over the edge, and he was in no mood for ditzing around with "do you really want to do that?"

Well, meh, that still implies that Spoony killed Joe because he wanted to kill Joe.

Eh, well, it's not like this will change Joe's playing style, so it's still just Spoony killing Joe.

i thought it was hilarious

Well, 57 dmg in one round is pretty awesome, but meh, it's still quite meh.

It doesn't Imply that he -wanted- to kill Vane at all. People forget that action in these games have consequences. The guards attacking makes sense, if they didn't attack it would feel like a form of favoritism. They would have attacked anyone else that didn't surrender.

It made for some damn good entertainment, and that's all that I really require.

Rant time:

It wasn't Noah out for blood. What Noah did is what any DM with more then a year experience under their belt and that cares about logic would have done and that's attack him with the guards.

Also if you look at the rolls all the rolls were high for all the damage and attack rolls. Two of the attacks rolled max damage. It wasn't sure thing Joe would die but he did. If Noah wanted him dead for sure he would have sent all the guards but he only sent 4 to him. (6 new guards showed up)

Rolls:

AR:19,20,14,13 (all got +7)
DR:12,12,11,6 (all +4)
As you can see Noah roll over 10 on all four of his attack rolls and on his damage rolls he got two max damage, one that as 1 off from another max damage and a 6.

Anyone that thinks what Noah did was because he didn't like Joe has never DMed or is too nice a DM that fears ever taking any PCs near death. You know the kind that stops doing blast attacks because there's a near dead PC near by that would be in the blast.

Also if you listen to them talk after the battle you can hear Noah talk to Joe as to why it happened.

Another thing to note others have been killed off before. Two guys before this and almost another died, they were killed before Jason started recording. Death is a part of DnD.

Also Joe got over it, if you didn't leave after the game you could hear Joe's new character getting made (Lord Vane's son) and Joe ended up happy in the end because now he gets to do an epic quest to avenge his father. (He's playing a Swordmage now and yes he does have his trademark lightning powers)

Dying in a game of DnD will leave you happy in the end if you aren't a crybaby and you have a good DM.

Rant time over.

On other talk about the dnd:

It's fun to watch but I wish they could roleplay more as that's when the big laughs happen. The burning wheel is going to be fun but I got a feeling the first few games are going to have a lot of rule questions as it's a harder game to pick up then 4e so it may drag at times.

I enjoy these games more then the penny arcade podcasts and if they get the burning wheel going it'll be pure gold.

Tarkenfire, I think you are wrong. Spoony was not mad at the players. Go back in time a bit, Spoony cut his teeth on AD&D, you know, real D&D. The game where wizards were lucky to have 3 HP at level 1, and where players were expected to not make stupid decisions, because there wasn't an entitlement of character survival.
That was a total "I can reload my save" move, and Joe had been playing too long for freebies. This wasn't Joe's first session, and he had shown some degree of common sense with Vane, Spoony was not wrong in expecting Joe not to do that, and having the guards react realistically when he did.

I didn't expect my reply to insert into the thread, and not drop on the end.

What I wrote (that got injected in after Tarkenfire's first post)

"Tarkenfire, I think you are wrong. Spoony was not mad at the players. Go back in time a bit, Spoony cut his teeth on AD&D, you know, real D&D. The game where wizards were lucky to have 3 HP at level 1, and where players were expected to not make stupid decisions, because there wasn't an entitlement of character survival.
That was a total "I can reload my save" move, and Joe had been playing too long for freebies. This wasn't Joe's first session, and he had shown some degree of common sense with Vane, Spoony was not wrong in expecting Joe not to do that, and having the guards react realistically when he did."

Yeah it seemed to me much more of a case joe made a bad move and it backfired.

Tho i didn't get to hear as far as joe's new character being made made, far as i got he was in the process of making =/

oh well look forward to seeing him in action again =D

I played AD&D and yes at lvl 1 you could die from someone sneezing on you.

Joe made a stupid decision, one that I think came from the fact that he is used to video game RPG's where you can reload if things go bad, and he got caught by some lucky rolls and killed.

I personally think that spoony was going to have them attack one round and then give him the option to surrender again...but it didn't turn out that way.

Roll a new char and learn from your mistakes.

Or...he could have actually just done a dm-fudged strength check verses Joe's probably very bad fortitude...in all honesty, if the royal guards are that undisciplined to take down a moron with a stick without impaling him, then the humans are doomed.

Set aside the new-age "protect the characters" attitude, and think realistically from the point of view of the guards. They ordered a known armed and dangerous suspect to drop his weapon and he refused, so they used lethal force.

It is neither undisciplined or unrealistic to use lethal force on an armed and hostile suspected murderer.

Ok Mr.fire lets do this.

You run into a room to find your king dead, a dragon dead, a well known high ranking elf dead, and some people you have never seen before today being the only ones standing besides your own men. You ask them to drop their weapons and one says "hell no". I'd fear for the human race if they didn't kill him right then and there.

Also the guards aren't dumb, they know there is magic that can be used with a staff, that's basic knowledge in the D&D world and calling it a stick is ludicrous.

Ok, let's assume - for all intents and purposes - that Tarkenfire's premise of "Spoony was just trying to kill Joe" is valid. Why, then, did he give Joe the opportunity to surrender? Why didn't he just outright attack him with the guards without even saying "drop your weapons"? Furthermore, why would Spoony target Joe in particular... wouldn't it seem prudent that - if anyone else in the party refused to surrender - the guards would attack them too? As someone else pointed out, this is not a post-modern utopian society where the police and corrections attempt to rehabilitate, rather than incarcerate or execute, criminals. This is a medieval alternate universe where justice is served at the end of a blade.

Okay, going realism on this, if you're a guard, it is presumed you have a
certain level of training and discipline, and the death of a superior, even if
one assumes that a system of fealty exists and that king = god, destroys this discipline then the
training has failed. Therefore, my thesis remains, the humans are...human, but
these are the so-called "royal guards", they should be held to a higher standard
than normal-humans (at least that's how it works with elite military units I've
heard about).

This requires explanation, I suppose. Now, I didn't get the real backstory to
the campaign, so allow me to explain what my pre-conceptions on the subject
entail:
The King who got amber-fyed, he was the king of a VERY powerful Human-based
empire, now, don't care bout the other empires for this purpose.

Now, assuming that this kingdom is very powerful, one would assume it's military
is well trained in situations (even if they are behind on the magic arts of teh
Elves), now, I would make the broad assumption that the guards in the throne
room were what could be called "Royal Guards" and that the guards that
reinforced them were either "Royal Guards" as well or at the very least a
"Palace Guard", either way, it is assumed that these troops would be "a cut
above" the rest of the normal troops.

This said, one would expect that guards such as this would have been trained in
what to do in case something happens to the king; see, this is a world with
fucking ebil magic portals and dragons, it would be assumed that the king might
bite it one day. It would also be assumed that said "biters" would be more than
reluctant to surrender. Now, in the case of a large armed group, it is quite the
logical solution. Let me break down the group that was in the throne room:

1 Well-Endowed Druid with a magical Totem, who surrendered.
1 Bard with a crappy ceremonial sword, who surrendered.
1 Bald Russian dude with a greataxe, who surrendered.
1 Dumbass who is laughing with a staff, going "who the fuck are you?", who
doesn't surrender.

Now, there is a thing that trained combatants (and or guards and the like) tend
to do when trained, called threat analysis. Now, this is the process of
determining if one is a doom wizard of doom or just some moron wizard who
near-flunked his way though the academy so he can call himself the lord of
lightning. Now, the counter for this thought would be "WHOOOO! magics is are
scary! They is country folk". No, they are guards in the capitol city of a major
empire, it is a natural conclusion to assume they are versed in magic lore at
the very least. (not seeing the monster sheets for them means I have to assume
like this)

A natural conclusion to the "capitol guard" train of thought, one would think
they would be more trained with the countering of threats to the king, and the
previous conclusion that they would be capable of maintaining their composure in
the event of something magical happens to the king (he might not be dead, and
the probable training in the arcane probably indicates that the king MIGHT not
be dead), this discipline, the discipline which is the key point in my article,
would lead you to the conclusion that the ones who are most suspect in this room
are probably most likely the ones responsible. Well, common sense does that, but
this discipline and this training would MOST likely lead the guards to believe
that a magic user is most likely behind the whole "our king is a fucking
crystal" issue, and while it obviously isn't Juliet or Lord Commander General
Admiral Duke Duchess Grand-Master Count Lieutenant Commandant Air-Marshall
Lord-of-the-dance-of-the-funk Vane, they likely know more about it than "I grab
bucket of shit for great defense" Victor or "The Spider Queen's bitch" Garret,
so the general idea is that they should be kept alive for the sake of TORTCHA
(it's a MST3K reference)

I don't have privy to Chris' char sheet, but if I were to assume, as the guards
likely did, that Juliet wasn't gonna be the "I'm gonna live through a lot of
torture" type. Granted, she could turn into a bear, but she wasn't a bear at the
time. Lord Commander General Admiral Duke Duchess Grand-Master Count Lieutenant
Commandant Air-Marshall Lord-of-the-dance-of-the-funk Vane Esquire was a better
source of information.

This is only a theory, of course, and it is based on assumption that the guards
were in fact better than the usual rabble and that they would see the value of
keeping Lord Commander General Admiral Duke Duchess Grand-Master Count
Lieutenant Commandant Air-Marshall Lord-of-the-dance-of-the-funk Vane Esquire
CPL alive.

Can my assumption be wrong? Of course. There are no absolutes in the realms of
science, and the same is true in the realms of table-top role playing games.

So, let's explore this avenue, if my base assumption, that the guards are
trained for unexpected situations and how to remain calm in them, is false, then
my theory is without base. The guards are simply stab-happy morons to whom the
depths of tactical might include such stratagems as "Stab things" and whose
discipline can be measured in mead.

If that were the case, if my assumption were wrong, my theory on the reasoning
for the death of Lord Commander General Admiral Duke Duchess Grand-Master
Lieutenant Commandant Air-Marshall Lord-of-the-dance-of-the-funk Vane Esquire
CPL, the Count of Monte-Cristo is also wrong. However, my secondary thesis,
that the kingdom is fairly "doomed' as it were in this war with the Elves has a
sound basing.

There is a factor that is overlooked in this dissection, a factor mentioned in
my very first statement of this article, realism. Yes, reality. If this were
real, this is how it would happen. This is not the case. (I've yet to see any
Elves in my local supermarket) D&D is a roleplaying game, after all, it is an
escape from reality, to inject the thought of perfect recreations of reality
into it's concepts undermines the concept itself. That might just be the
answer, Mr. Antwiler simply wasn't trying to add a perfect reality into his
game, and what resulted from this loose reality was the death of Betitled Vane,
Title. And the fault in this case is in the eyes of the beholder, all an
opinion of how thought-out the reactions of certain individuals should be, all
in the methods of which games are played out, all in the pantheon of the story
the DM creates.

Where does this leave us? In my opinion (and remember,this whole writing is
simply my opinion), there are three scenarios for which the reasoning of this
death could be explain.

Firstly, it could be just an oversight on the part of Mr. Antwiler, he simply
did not think the situation out correctly and left too much to the luck of dice
rolls, which, while lucky for him, were not lucky for Mr. Vargus. This is no
slight against Mr. Antwiler, for being a DM is a daunting task, and what he has
done with making his own story and crafting a world is, quite frankly,
amazing. The minute details just to be worked out more.

Secondly, it can just be that the guards are idiots. This bring up questions on
how an empire who can only guard it's sovereign monarch has not collapsed to
this point, however one can wave this fact with number of troops or inept
enemies, however unlikely this is.

Lastly, it could be a case of showmanship taking value over reality. Mr.
Antwiler might have just taken the flashier option for the sake of dramatics. A
DM can do as they wish, after all, and DMs are human, after all. Perhaps it was
a mechanism for the story to progress, who may know? Mr. Antwiler is the answer
to that question, and only he can have the final say in this discussion.

As to what I believe, I tend to lean to the first option. This said, I also
believe something from the third option, the only one who can give a definitive
answer to this question is one Mr. Noah Antwiler. Last I checked, that was not
my name, and I doubt many of you who will read this will have that name either.

Which leads me to my conclusion, the preceding 18 paragraphs are
meaningless.Aside from the DM, no one will likely ever know the reasoning
behind this course of action. This is simply my opinion on the matter, and
unless Noah decides it is called for to explain his reasoning, it is the best
answer I can create. Of course, opinions are generally different for different
people, so I do not anticipate any agreement on this theory...actually
theories, but quite frankly, I don't give a damn, since this gave me an excuse
to practice writing and killed quite a bit of time.

If you don't care then.. why go to the length to explain all this? Does the whole event really bother you -that- much?

Read the last sentence of the post.

I did, it still doesn't explain why you went ahead and posted it.

It would've been a waste not to.

No, it's that you cannot be wrong.

Fire, everything in that post you just you talking with bent logic. :/

What this all comes down to is Joe pretty much jumped into a 100ft deep pit saying he could fly. The DM will kill you if you do something like that or the DM will be called on playing favorites. Noah wasn't going to hold Joe's hand as he left that to the other players and everyone told him he shouldn't do it but he did.

Of course it is, steve, winning minor arguments (well, trying to at least, I'm quite wrong this time, it would be quite hard to win) makes my life feel marginally more important.

Look, this whole conversation on whether or not spoony was justified in killing Lord "Master of the Disco" Vaine will not bring him back. In D&D the NPC's act how the DM wants them to act, if spoony thought that in that situation that this was a reasonable respons to Joe's actions than we have no choice but to come to terms with this fact. Joe has a brand new character and is ready to avenge the death of Lord "Lightning Butterfly" Vaine making me more interested in the story.

Now moving past this whole debate does anyone have any ideas as to what "Your escape is through the tombs"(I think that was what he said) means. Perhaps a great evil is going to destroy the world and there only escape from his wrath is death? That's my theory anyway.

This is probably the reason some of them were cautious about streaming D&D. Seriously, take a step back and don't try to make it out as something more than it was. A character died (in glorious fashion I might add), who was not the first one to die btw, and that was it. It's time to move on, because it's a pleasure to hear such an entertaining campaign, but if we continue to nitpick or debate about someones "motives" in this fashion it might not continue.

Anyway about the tombs thing, I think it was just a literal escape plan for them to get out of the castle?

Sigh...can't even fool around these days w/o people going all meh.

Yes, it was just something that happened in the course of the campaign, I'll move on ._.

I imagine the tombs thing is literal as well.

Hey guys,

I dug up my trash Twitter account (Verrekreth) and have designated it the official Twitter of the Channel Awesome D&D sessions :p All recorded Ustreams will be put up there for your convenience, along with updates of session status in case games will be missed.

http://twitter.com/Verrekreth

Interesting, an account named after the bane of our good Lord Vane. All rhyming aside, don't you think it's a little too soon? I mean, the guy JUST died. We should honor his death. Like, seriously, making an account called Verrekreth, man, that's super lame. Try having some respect for dead characters, geez.

All kidding aside, this looks fairly legit, but you might need to delete that DotWar comment. Because men don't fight with dots.

It's also worth pointing out that the Castellian seems more than a little shady and was perfectly happy to remove the adventurers from the picture quite painfully with very little prompting. (He seemed content to kill off the party in the dungeon after wards until the Hulk appeared) Who knows what the guards had been ordered before they entered the room?

They may have been well trained, but that doesn't mean they weren't following orders from a guy who seems to bear the party a great deal of enmity.

Personally, I agree. Talbot isn't to be trusted, and I honestly suspect him of using this as an opportunity to seize control of the crown by manipulating the fragile emotions of a worn child. How things play out are really going to play by ear, but I've got a few ideas on how to proceed, but none of them are fool proof. That's a lot of the excitement for me though. I'm always intrigued to see how a situation develops and react accordingly.

I do pray we can get our equipment back quickly though. I realize that Juliet is nearly useless without her implement. Think a rat corpse and some dung will count as a mystic totem?

RolloT you can make a home made totem and use it for your spells. You just need some wood or bone and somehow mark it with a image of one of the spirits you call on. If you really want you could pull a chair leg off and use a dagger/sword to try and turn it into a totem...you could use a bone so you may cut some bone out of that dead guy...but the wood thing is easier as you still need to cut into the bone. But ya it's doable.

Also I always think any character the DM gives a name is evil or will be. It'd be best if you kill everyone that spoony tells you the name of. :D

IIRC, you do not need an implement to use powers with the implement keyword. Only that powers with that keyword gain the benefit of bonuses from the implement, and class features you have that stack because of the implement; such as the wizard's orb if imposition.

But if you feel it is important to have one, Jared's right. A simple homemade totem is fine, it just grants no bonuses.

Like he said, find a piece of wood and use one of the other character's found weapons to etch some symbols important to Juliet's patron spirits into it. It will not grant any bonuses, but it is at least an implement.

Anyone noticed that Joe changed his attitude, not quite 180 degrees, but definitely more team-oriented? He celebrated Grae getting a kill on his target, didn't yell at anyone that was trying to kill his targets, even tried to roleplay some when he was describing his origins. That, plus his trademark passion; he's gonna be a player to remember. ;)

Now I dont know exactly what happened or why what happened. But in any RPG, when a DM asks you "DO YOU REALLY WANT TO DO THAT?" you as a player should think about rethinking your move especsially when you are an RPG Newbie or your character is very low level.

People should never take it personally when the DM punishes his character, for the players mistake. A nice DM might save them or give them another chance, a normal DM not, a true Asshole RPG will punish the players character even more harsh.

Basicly if you are going up against 6 guards, have a backuplan (a way to flee when the hp gets very low) or be prepared to die.

Spoony did nothing unjust in my opinion.

Wow is this thread really having a conspiracy theory discussion about if Spoony had it in for angry joe?

If so I absolutely agree, Spoony remembered that civil disagreement they had about X-Com and staged an entire D&D campaign just to cause minor inconvenience to angry joe. He would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for us internet detectives.

Haha good reply Prons I agree :)

Last time I played with D&D was with friends around a table several years ago, before the use of Internet. I see that now it's possible to share maps and fights online using OpenRPG. Cool!

Because I'm crazy or something, I just created a TV Tropes page for the campaign:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SpoonysCampaign

I wish I knew how to add an apostrophe to the title. Also, I know there are other tropes that can be added, but I think that's a good starting point. You guys can always add more.

Does Lord Vane still have the treasure map he bought from that halfling? I'm interested in seeing if the map is a scam or not...

Ya Lord Vane still has the map but they have more pressing matters in Darstines possession and Garrets taint. Also anyone know which session it was that Joe asked if Darstine had boobs and they spent lik10 min'making jokes.

Sooo, completely off topic, does anyone know what spoony and them use whilst playing, as in, what program are they using for the maps?

and dice, i know, im completely hopeless

inamidato wrote: "Last time I played with D&D was with friends around a table several years ago, before the use of Internet. I see that now it's possible to share maps and fights online using OpenRPG. Cool!"

Darabka: I know, my cousin had made a custom made RPG for us, which he DM'ed, it was set in the Castlevania Universe. The worst question I knew while playing was: "DO YOU REALLY WANT TO DO THAT?".

Lord Vane attacked the guards by himself, and everyone else gave up immediately. Him dying was unexpected but seems to have turned out for the best.

I am unable to find a recording of fight with the scorpion queen. I've look on LordKat's site and his Ustream. Does anybody have a link to the recording or was it not recorded?

Thank you

It does not have a recording. But Rollo T has done a written recap of it.. Check out his site: http://rollot.blogspot.com

Doesn't anyone know when the next session will be for D&D with spoony? cause I want to watch.

I think they are normally on Sundays starting at... 6PM EST?